From what I've heard, most fans believe "Safer" Sephiroth is a mistranslation of "Seraph" Sephiroth...
but I was browsing Amazon.com, and noticed a book that covers "Sepher Sephiroth", which sounds a lot closer to "safer" than "seraph" does... I'm trying to dig up more into on what the Sepher Sephiroth IS, but from what I can gather atm, it's another version of the Sephirot/h?
Here's a link to the book 777 and Other Qabalistic Writings of Aleister Crowley: Including Gematria and Sepher Sephiroth (via Amazon) that caught my attention with the mention of Sepher Sephiroth.
Pre-posting Edit: Ok, based on "Hilkot Yetzirah" meaning "Rules of Creation" and "Sepher Yetzirah" meaning "Book of Creation", rule out the above "Creation Sephiroth" thing. (it would have been a cool idea, though)
Of course, that is drawing from a Wiki article; such things need to be taken with a grain of salt.
Useful other spelling:
How is "Safer Sephiroth" written in the Japanese version of FFVII?
Continuing researching into this...
I've also heard, on another FF7 related thing somewhere, a long time ago, about how the "One Winged Angel" was fallen from heaven. Also heard that there are two one winged angels, and in order to fly they have to hold each other up, being the support for the other. Or something. Just a random memory ^_^; which makes sense because Cloud's KH form has a wing on the opposite side of Sephiroth.
ah, yes... One-Winged Angel, Fallen Angel, and all that = Satan. *wracks brain* was that his original "angel" name? I can't remember...
The two one-winged angels... can you tell me more about that? That sounds really interesting
Two "aspects" of Jenova's (remaining) consiousness? One "good", one "bad". But which is which? From Jenova's POV, Sephiroth is a good son, aiding her in her purging the world of mindless, disrespectful fools.
I think that at some point in the timeline of FFVII, Sephiroth's and Jenova's consiousnesses(spl?) fuse, though IMO, Sephiroth's will is stronger. The man that was known as General Sephiroth only partially exists "now", if at all. Perhaps he lost his humanity that day, and gave into the Jenova cells, but came to see them as a new source of power? I'm going in circles x_x
and WHAT did you call the SMH? o_o *huggles them*
Not sure how many wings Sephiroth has...
Counting his right arm/wing, he's got 7?
I'm not a religion buff... what's "above" a Seraph?
aside: One of the Google Image links, although broken, had the desc "Seraph Savior Safer Sepher Sephiroth", so someone else out there has the Sepher idea too...
Huh, shows how long it's been since I last got a good look at him in that form.
I don't think there is an "above", IIRC, there's only two types of angels described in the bible, cherubim and seraphim. If there's anything above that I supose it's the Archangel Michael (who, despite popular belief, I think is just another name for Jesus) but that is all I can think of.
I was just thinking along the lines of having another wing would make him "higher" than the other forms.
More support for Savior Sephiroth, then?
What about being a God?
Though that arm/wing reminds me more of his One-Winged Angel form wing...
showing signs of being corrupted by power?
I'm just musing here...
That reminds me of something our preist said at mass (waaaay back when my parents still dragged me to church). "You see all these horrible, gotesque images of the Devil; everyone expects him to be ugly. But I think the Devil would take on a beautiful form - embodying lust and temptation..." (I'm sort of paraphrasing here).
Do I really need to explain how Sephiroth relates to that? =P
personally, I don't want to pick just one theory to believe. I don't want to commit my mindset to one idea alone.
that's kind of my general approach to religion - I don't think one single religion can be right. There are key elements most/all of them share, and I think some odd blend of everything is as close to whatever real "truth" there is as we're going to get.
Again, I'm not religous, but it is interesting to look at, study even, from a more... psychological point of view.
there was something else about Seph that I wanted to mention for the past few comments, but I can't remember what it was now... >_
^^; I didn't offend you or anything, did I?
I'm far too logical and analytical to ever seriously consider a religion for myself. I'm just cold and detached from humanity like that. =P
Still can't remember what I was going to say... x_x
well iiiff you wanna know the truth, I think he's a bit more than not attractive, actually, in game and in the official pics/ac screenshots.. I also don't like his personality/character much, either pre-nibelheim or post-nibelheim. Not that I'm bashing him, I think he's an essential character to the story and all that, but he's one of the few villians that I actually don't like XD;
I can't really put my finger on why though.
I guess this is getting off topic.. ^_^;
(I'm just being honest with you, no killings, ok? ^_^;)
but absolute power corrupts absolutely.
btw, I think "Sepher Sephiroth" is literally "Book of Numbers". Which makes sense...
It's been a while... Seph uses SuperNova in is "Safer" (*snort*) form, right? And you see all those number, calculations...
(psst, you should log in Dr_Hojo)
Hm. Well, a lot of the mythology *is* from the West. Can't think of how else that might relate... Hojo's Lab is in Midgar(d), which is in the mid-eastern part of the World Map... Nibelhiem is more to the West, though.
IMO, I think it's just a coincidence; nothing was really ment by it. And like I said, they could haved used "ze" instead of "se" to spell his name.
This might sound a bit odd, but I noticed some interesting things about Sephiroth's attack names.
One of his attacks is called "Stigma" which is interesting because that's part the name of the fatal disease he's using to control the Lifestream, "Geostigma."
Another attack he has is "Pale Horse," which can be thought of as Pegasus (white horse with wings) and Sephiroth has quite a few wings in his final form. That was kind of random, but I think it's a cool thought to keep in mind. :)
Oh and I'm working on an entry for this awesome community today. ;)
Hey thats really interesting I didn't realise he had an attack called Stigma.. I think its because the last time I played FF7 I beat Sephiroth before he had a chance to use any named attacks.. (not a good thing I don't like easy battles).. but I do remember Pale Horse - it caused me an awful lot of problems as a newbie I recall.... Its interesting what the horse thing could signify - Pegasus would seem obvious but I can't see how that would relate to Sephiroth at all - Pegasus was a son of Poseidon and Medusa - when Perseus slew Medusa Pegasus was born fully formed from her blood (I think)- Posiedon was the father of all horses (he supposedly made them - a white horse can be associated with sea foam and waves) - I suppose Medusa could be like Jenova in someways - they would look pretty similar with Medusa being a Gorgon - oh yeah and Medusa turned people to stone - which is a status attack - and "Pale Horse" was a load of status attacks wasn't it? Maybe I'm just making cheap links now.... ^ ^
Actually, I think "Pale Horse" is a reference to the fourth Horseman of the Apocalypse (i.e. Death):
"And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."
This would also fit more with the Judeo-Christian theme going on with Sephiroth, I think.
Stigma=stigmata, the name of the condition that Jesus had when crucified. (Blood runs from the palms of the hands and the soles of the feet.) Or, I believe the stigma is a part of a flower's anatomy. So "Geostigma" could be "Earth's (Geo's) Stigmata"...
This is all very interesting.. as I was saying in reply to another post there has been a lot of info floating around the comm regarding this sort of stuff... at some point I think I should gather it all up and maybe post an essay regarding all the ideas... so it is easy to access in one post... it seems to be one of the main interests in how FF7 relates to myth... maybe bacause it is more obvious.. and probably because it is more familiar to us in the West seeing as though it is mostly rooted in Christan and Jewish mythology.. (and as there is a lot of Sephiroth fangirls such as yourself ^ ^)
Ah, that'd be *great* if we had all these links and info lumped into on entry... and make it a Memory or something.
I wonder WHY there's so much Western religeous influence in these games made in Japan... is it exotic to them?
Yeah I think it would be - when everyone seems to have run out of steam on the subject I may well do that.
I suppose Western religions must be exotic to them - much in the same way that their religions seem exotic to us - I mean we use their religions for films etc - for example in Star Wars and The Matrix, I think with Japanese games it can't be much different.
If you think about it as well the whole stereotypical fantasy genre originally developed in the West - with LOTR and medieval influences etc - the Japanese liked all that - took it up and developed it further into all the wonderful games we have today.
I've never really heard much dispute over the translation of Sephiroth's name... it's printed as Sephiroth, said as such, and seen in SE's official guides and such as "Sephiroth"
I'd think that if they wanted Zephyrus, they would've used "ゼ(ze)" instead of "セ(se)"
ゼフィロス... ゼフィラス...? (not sure how "Zephyrus" is pronounced in English ^^; )
Tell me more about Zephyr, though. I'm not familiar with it/him/that...
Zephyrus is really close to Sephiroth when pronounced: Zeh-fir-uhs. Zephyrus was said to be the only "good" wind--in both the sense that sailors wanted the breezy west wind the most, and Zephyrus' character was mild-mannered, while his brothers were boisterous and violent. He is the son of Eos the Dawn and Asterius the god of starlight. He once fell in love with a boy named Hyacinthus, who was killed and his blood turned into the hyacinth flowers. Zephyrus also married a mortal woman, but I don't remember the name.